Friday, July 26, 2013

The most Hall of Famers, update 2

This is my second update in an attempt to find the Topps flagship set with the most Hall of Famers.

I wanted to cover two different sets this time out, but I ran into a couple of road blocks with the first one and then my back started aching (I'm such an old man), so we're sticking with just one.

It's a good one. It's the 1975 Topps set, my all-time favorite.

Some people speculated that this set would have the most Hall of Famers, surpassing the so-far record 44 of the 1969 set. The '75 set is understandably well-respected, mentioned often for its star power.

But I'm not so sure it has what it takes.

Taking into account only the current card from each particular player or manager from that particular set, there are 41 Hall of Famers in the 1975 set, which falls short of 1969 and one other I've already reviewed.

But then there's the question of what to do with these:


The MVPs subset in '75 Topps is loaded with Hall of Famers, but I don't feel comfortable including them in the count.

First, I've already said I'm only considering current players from that set. So players like Koufax and Mays who appeared in the MVP subset aren't eligible.

But what about Frank Robinson here? And Johnny Bench, Reggie Jackson, Harmon Killebrew, Willie McCovey, etc., etc.? They were all current players in the '75 set.

Well, my feeling is, they already have a card in the set, I'm not counting it twice. Hank Aaron has a base card and a Record-Breaker card and I counted him only one time. Some of the sets of the '60s feature separate All-Star cards of players who already have base cards and I counted each of those players just one time.

So, unless there's something I'm missing (leave your outcries in the comments), then I'm not counting the MVP subset.

Also, there's the matter of this:


Yogi Berra is in the Hall of Fame.

But he's there as a player not a manager.

Do I count him in the Hall of Fame list? He's current. But as a manager, not a player, for which he received his HOF accolades.

I'm saying no.

If I read a convincing argument otherwise then I'll bump the total up to 42. But right now it stays at 41. (UPDATE: I been convinced! Yogi's added and the total is officially 42).

So here is the list so far with the 1975 set added:


1956 (28): Hank Aaron, Walter Alston, Luis Aparicio, Richie Ashburn, Ernie Banks, Yogi Berra, Roy Campanella, Roberto Clemente, Larry Doby, Bob Feller, Whitey Ford, Warren Giles, Will Harridge, Monte Irvin, Al Kaline, Harmon Killebrew, Sandy Koufax, Mickey Mantle, Eddie Mathews, Willie Mays, Pee Wee Reese, Phil Rizzuto, Robin Roberts, Jackie Robinson, Duke Snider, Warren Spahn, Hoyt Wilhelm, Ted Williams


1963 (34): Hank Aaron, Walter Alston, Luis Aparicio, Richie Ashburn, Ernie Banks, Yogi Berra, Lou Brock, Jim Bunning, Orlando Cepeda, Roberto Clemente, Don Drysdale, Whitey Ford, Bob Gibson, Whitey Herzog, Al Kaline, Harmon Killebrew, Sandy Koufax, Mickey Mantle, Juan Marichal, Bill Mazeroski, Willie Mays, Willie McCovey, Stan Musial, Robin Roberts, Brooks Robinson, Frank Robinson, Ron Santo, Duke Snider, Warren Spahn, Willie Stargell, Hoyt Wilhelm, Billy Williams, Dick Williams, Carl Yastrzemski



1968 (40): Hank Aaron, Walter Alston, Luis Aparicio, Ernie Banks, Johnny Bench, Lou Brock, Jim Bunning, Rod Carew, Steve Carlton, Orlando Cepeda, Roberto Clemente, Don Drysdale, Bob Gibson, Jim Hunter, Fergie Jenkins, Al Kaline, Harmon Killebrew, Mickey Mantle, Juan Marichal, Eddie Mathews, Willie Mays, Bill Mazeroski, Willie McCovey, Joe Morgan, Phil Niekro, Jim Palmer, Tony Perez, Gaylord Perry, Brooks Robinson, Frank Robinson, Nolan Ryan, Ron Santo, Red Schoendienst, Tom Seaver, Willie Stargell, Don Sutton, Hoyt Wilhelm, Billy Williams, Dick Williams, Carl Yastrzemski



1969 (44): Hank Aaron, Walter Alston, Luis Aparicio, Ernie Banks, Johnny Bench, Lou Brock, Jim Bunning, Rod Carew, Steve Carlton, Orlando Cepeda, Roberto Clemente, Don Drysdale, Leo Durocher, Rollie Fingers, Bob Gibson, Jim Hunter, Reggie Jackson, Fergie Jenkins, Al Kaline, Harmon Killebrew, Mickey Mantle, Juan Marichal, Willie Mays, Bill Mazeroski, Willie McCovey, Joe Morgan, Phil Niekro, Jim Palmer, Tony Perez, Gaylord Perry, Brooks Robinson, Frank Robinson, Nolan Ryan, Ron Santo, Red Schoendienst, Tom Seaver, Willie Stargell, Don Sutton, Earl Weaver, Hoyt Wilhelm, Billy Williams, Dick Williams, Ted Williams, Carl Yastrzemski



1970 (42): Hank Aaron, Walter Alston, Sparky Anderson, Luis Aparicio, Ernie Banks, Johnny Bench, Lou Brock, Jim Bunning, Rod Carew, Steve Carlton, Orlando Cepeda, Roberto Clemente, Leo Durocher, Rollie Fingers, Bob Gibson, Jim Hunter, Reggie Jackson, Fergie Jenkins, Al Kaline, Harmon Killebrew, Juan Marichal, Willie Mays, Bill Mazeroski, Willie McCovey, Joe Morgan, Phil Niekro, Jim Palmer, Tony Perez, Gaylord Perry, Brooks Robinson, Frank Robinson, Nolan Ryan, Ron Santo, Red Schoendienst, Tom Seaver, Willie Stargell, Don Sutton, Earl Weaver, Hoyt Wilhelm, Billy Williams, Ted Williams, Carl Yastrzemski



1975 (42): Hank Aaron, Walt Alston, Sparky Anderson, Johnny Bench, Yogi Berra, George Brett, Lou Brock, Bert Blyleven, Rod Carew, Steve Carlton, Gary Carter, Rollie Fingers, Carlton Fisk, Bob Gibson, Rich Gossage, Jim "Catfish" Hunter, Reggie Jackson, Fergie Jenkins; Al Kaline, Harmon Killebrew, Willie McCovey, Joe Morgan, Phil Niekro, Jim Palmer, Tony Perez, Gaylord Perry, Jim Rice, Brooks Robinson, Frank Robinson, Nolan Ryan, Ron Santo, Mike Schmidt, Red Schoendienst, Tom Seaver, Willie Stargell, Don Sutton, Earl Weaver, Billy Williams, Dick Williams, Dave Winfield, Carl Yastrzemski, Robin Yount



1983 (41): Sparky Anderson, Johnny Bench, Bert Blyleven, Wade Boggs, George Brett, Rod Carew, Steve Carlton, Gary Carter, Andre Dawson, Dennis Eckersley, Rollie Fingers, Carlton Fisk, Rich Gossage, Tony Gwynn, Rickey Henderson, Whitey Herzog, Reggie Jackson, Fergie Jenkins, Tom Lasorda, Paul Molitor, Joe Morgan, Eddie Murray, Phil Niekro, Jim Palmer, Tony Perez, Gaylord Perry, Jim Rice, Cal Ripken, Frank Robinson, Nolan Ryan, Ryne Sandberg, Mike Schmidt, Tom Seaver, Ozzie Smith, Don Sutton, Bruce Sutter, Earl Weaver, Dick Williams, Dave Winfield, Carl Yastrzemski, Robin Yount


Again, if I've missed anyone -- and that is entirely possible -- please let me know, as someday this whole list will be on the sidebar.

Thanks.

8 comments:

  1. Add one more to 1975: Jim Rice

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  2. Ack. Four-player rookie cards.

    Will do! Thanks.

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  3. I say count Berra with 75, but I have no compelling argument.

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  4. I don't know how compelling it is, but here goes.

    Let's use an example. When Ryne Sandberg gets the Phillies manager job as expected after this season, he will be referred to as Hall of Famer Ryne Sandberg. Let's further assume that over the next 20 years Ryne Sandberg is one of the best managers in the league and wins consistently. Would he be considered for the HOF as a manager also? I wouldn't think so. Therefore, if a guy is a HOFer then he is a HOFer no matter what position he is filling.

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  5. Hmmmmm. I'll have to think about that.

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  6. If you count Ted Williams in 1970 - don't you need to count Berra in 1975?

    ;)

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  7. Same goes for Red Schoendienst.

    I agree with Hiflew - I definitely count Berra in this instance. BUT! I also count retired players when I do this on my blog. Neither way is wrong - it's how you want to look at it.

    I get what you're saying about Alston being a HOF manager and Berra a HOF player. I'd just look at it differently. If a HOFer is "active", that can mean as a manager or coach. (Berra is on a card in 1987 with Houston as a coach).

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  8. Ding!

    lifetimetopps wins the compelling argument (and does my work for me, too).

    Yogi is an HOFer for 1975.

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